Streetlife

Yes, there's LOTS of other people on here advertising their various businesses! Unless you have to go to an allotted section to make actual 'posts' regarding your business? (i.e, perhaps it's OK to advertise your business on your profile, but not to post on the 'threads' about it?) 

not sure ........would hate to be 1st one expelled !

Actually it was a very polite and friendly little reminder that one of the rules of Streetlife (which everyone sees before they post their first message) is "please don't start conversations advertising your business".

The reason for this is that those businesses who pay to be able to send out deals and promotions to locals get a little peeved when others do it for free. Seeing as it's our business subscribers who make it possible for everyone else to use Streetlife for free, I don't think our rules are unreasonable.

Hope this helps explain, and that you're not quaking in your boots Phillip. 

:)

no  x im ok . obviously not reading instructions again ! sorry

Getting back to the original topic.  As has been hinted at in a previous posting, you cannot just take land area and divide it by the population and suggest that that is what each person has to live in.  Much of the world is unliveable in and unproductive.  The issue is how much land do we need to sustain the population, how much do we need for happy lives and how can we make best use of resources.  

Population expansion discussions often look overseas but we need to remember that, in terms of population density, the UK has one of the highest, with areas of very low population.  We also need to remember that recently we have had a rising birth rate, so are contributing to the problem, rather than solving it.

My concern is that the "Britain is full" argument usually leads to a "stop immigration" argument which leads to justification for some levels of racism.

It isn't in the interests of some businesses to stop immigration, particularly illegal immigration, because if they weren't able to depend on an immigrant workforce, they would not be able to pay below the minimum wage.  Fortunately, as with all things, not all employers adopt this line.

Sorry, I have combined two things!

"My concern is that the "Britain is full" argument usually leads to a "stop immigration" argument which leads to justification for some levels of racism."

Well said, Jane. That is exactly my concern on this subject.

Emperor wears no clothes.....

Jane, the landmass division per person is simply a way to demonstrate that the theory of overpopulation as posited by the media and academia and 'experts' is illogical.  

You repeat the problems of scarcity of resources and problems with distribution as given by the authorities as a reason to rile the public up about immigration and population (i.e. don't breed).  As The Guv' (without public consultation) sets immigration policies, rules and regs,  the onus is on The Guv' to serve the best interests of the people in this country and to ensure that their policies balance the resources they make available with the money they take from us. In this they have failed and continue to fail to manage our affairs intelligently, honestly and openly.

Anyone exploring the copious corporate excavations, drillings, pipe-line development etc. quickly realises that it is no problem with resources or distribution; the problem is in the deliberate by-pass of those resources and methods of distribution being used for public good. PPP's are marvelous ways of filching public funds for private purpose and profit without accountablility to the public and without accountability to the public there are few statute measures of control on their (often dangerous, sometimes disastrous activities). Basically saying that there is no problem with resources or ability to distribute those resources.

Britain is full as far as resources are being mismanaged by foreign interests and cut back via those same banksters. The majority of immigrants are of course, economic. Why are they fleeing their own countries? Because those same 'interests' have completely wrecked their countries and encouraged them to come, that's why.

What of the Brits migrating out for much the same economic and social (overcrowded cities/alienation) reasons? Anyone with the means and foresight would leave this brewing cauldron before she blows. Those coming from the countries where British Foreign interests have completely wrecked through piracy won't notice the degenration happening here and don't care. Others, academic and corporate immigrants will be heavily subsidised and treated with priority over the natives. Espcially those from China and Pakistan (by the by our industries and job opportunities went to support these countrie's 'growth' but we are not supposed to know that).

UK has always been densely populated in the cities. Immigration is not connected with xenophobia; it is purely a division of labour and resources but because of successive Guv mismanagement, no consultation was given on immigration or measures taken to be sensitive to the introduction of widely differing cultures into confined areas. Common sense.

It is not 'racist' to defend your bretheren, values, ideals, aspirations, land or investments and believe me every single one of us have made heavy investments in this State, as have those others robbed on foreign lands.

It is this false slur of 'racism' which stops discussions of immigration in its tracks or manages to have them derailed at the first juncture; hence the continuing status quo. There has been a deliberate policy of flooding the country with displaced people (first led by labour, Wilson then Blair) with the intention of smashing any cohesive British Culture as held by the common people of their identiry. The records are there for all to see. It is not racist to discuss immigration.

As for population, The Guv justifies rampant influx because we are now so conditioned to produce no more than 2.1 children per household (due to false overpopulaton propaganda) that they claim to require the extra workforce and taxes needed that immigrants bring. How can that make sense? Reduce the population of 'your own' country and compensate with foreigners breeding to make up the shortfall.

To keep populations stable, each individual must reproduce once; hence 2.5 children per couple. This is no longer happening. We are in decline. For a glaring example of the disaster of population control, check China.   Fertility is plummeting in males and females worldwide and according to WHO, the Western male sperm count is down by 70% compared with 1950 (NHS) and the remaining motive sperm are deformed; couldn't find an egg in a henhouse! Women too are becoming sterile due to toxicity via environment, vaccines and medications. The babies born live are merciless injected leading to sterility, insanity, disability and death. As we've all come through this in remarkably good shape, the least we've suffered is brain damage.

We are not made aware of the true stats of civilian murder via warfare in either the short or long term, or the stats of deaths from vaccines, organ theft and all the other lucrative horrors known and unkown kept off the radar of public awareness.  

There is no overpopulation crisis and there never was. There is no shortage of resources, just piracy of such through warfare. There is an abundance of natural energy alternatives which work with and not against nature such as oil, fracking and nuclear. The means of distrubution are at our disposal.

Getting back to the example of one acre of land for every human alive on this plant and breaking it down:

Each would be self-sufficient for growing food, building shelter, water and energy supply. As each produces food or makes products for self sufficiency, surplus is traded with neighbours, resources are shared as well. When the people have land, the people thrive on enterprise. Crafts are developed, standards are elevated for with them rests reputations and therefore ability to trade. Trust returns as community strengthens.Communities are self reliant and self policing. 

Trade tariffs are critical to this arrangement in order that the community or network of communities comprising nation are protected from sharp practice and foreign competition. Free Trade kills this natural arrangement as it has surely destroyed what was The United Kingdom and The United States of America: Free Trade Zone to any interests above those of the inhabitants. Tariffs keep imported or foreign goods realistically expensive compared to home produced, quality trade.Get rid of them and you get what we've had and what we've got.

Forget 'racism' as a gag to halt and divert understanding, discussion and for heaven's sake, a way forward to resolution. But if 'racism' is going to be used at all, an example is the way in which 'whiteys' are made to feel somehow guilty or responsible for a crime they never were in a position to commit and are beaten up and gagged for expressing sane concerns about immigration, crime and unemployment. It could be applied to 'whiteys' or 'white devils'  being victimised under positive prejudice statutes which are evidently used in prejudice against them for housing and jobs. Plenty of divergent races settled in this land are equally concerned about immigration, unemployment and crime - are they accused of 'racism' when expressing these concerns? Hardly.   

Immigration has been used throughout the history of piracy in control to undermine the workforce, keeping labour costs to starvation levels whilst underpinning the immigrant populace with false information about history, enslavement and who was and is responsible for the atrocities in their homeland. Thus a 'civil rights' front is formed as a means of division and quelling equality and justice for all with the same old beneficiaries of this conflict.

Passports were a fairly recent invention and by Common Law, all are allowed free passage without hindrance unless at war with the migrating inhabitants' country. Illegal immigration is allowed, supported and encouraged to fuel the black market ecomony and there's a fine line between what is black and white with much muddying of where one begins and the other ends. Illegal immigrants have a pretty awful existance of exploitation and it is a human rights travesty. Yet we are in no more of a position to help these people than we are to help ourselves because we are ignorant and in that ignorance we rely on the Guv to continue on until the inevitable conclusion. That conclusion will be evident soon enough if we continue with the snooze button on.

If we are serious in removing the obstacles to providing a healthy sane future for the children here and to come, we first have to remove the shackles of our enslavement when bullets of 'racism' 'sexism' 'homophobia' gag the potential for understanding, harmony and right action.

excellent ! wish you had some influence over future policies . honest talk and realism seem in short supply .

DaftAida: you should have noticed that I did not say that arguing against immigration is racist.  I would welcome a proper discussion about population, but that usually leads to cut immigration arguments, which then leads some members of the community to hijack the discussion with thinly veiled racism.

My suggestion on illegal immigration would be increased unannounced spot checks on employers and greater fines.  Looking at the law on self-employment to prevent tax evasion and employers getting round employment law.

I have always been proud that, as a country, we have always (and I mean always) welcomed people from around the world.  After all we thought we had a right to go to other countries and, some, still do. 

You are right that we have largely given away much of our financial control to overseas interests (I am not talking about the Common Market), but we should not scapegoat those at the bottom of the heap.

On population, I'm not sure where your figures come from.  The population of the UK is predicted to hit 70million - that is rising.  Logic tells us that replacement figures are 2 children per couple - but only if neither partner has had children with another partner.

The population of the UK has risen by about 20% since the '50s.  Although some of this is to do with immigration, much of this is to do with medical advances and increase life expectancy.  It is still also to do with family size and, although more recently this has dropped, we are still affected by baby booms.

Going back to the 1 acre argument.  We cannot put the clock back.  We have large cities, for good or bad.  The positive side of this is that we also have wonderful countryside, protected areas and wildlife.  Only this week there was an article about conservation groups deciding whether to allow the tiger or the giant panda to become extinct because of encroachment on their territories.  The 1 acre argument would put much of our UK wildlife at risk.  We should learn from the animal kingdom and what happens when a species becomes overcrowded.

Well said Jane. It is possible to discuss immigration without stooping to making racist comments. It's not automatically racist to be concerned about immigration, but it can lead some ignorant folk to make nasty far-right comments. That can cause the whole debate to descend into racism.

Here is what the DOCinaDAY kids made of this issue. Have a look on www.mystreetfilms.com to see if someone has made a short film about your local area

http://www.mystreetfilms.com/content/diversity

it seems very strange that the law states assylum seekers may go to the nearest safe country , are we sending out the wrong message and creating our own immigration problem ?? because im sure refugeeshave crossed at least 4 safe countries before they reach us .

And where would we go, to seek Assylum should a despotic regime take over? I asked this question of Tony Benn some years ago and he feigned a mixture of deafness and misunderstanding (old codgers get away with murder) proceding to elaborate on racism in this country. What I meant was, a regime which gagged free press and persecuted freedom of speech. Moderators, what happened to my last post? Your tactics have been noted but until now, let pass.